If a Fetus is a Human Being, All Pregnant Women Released from Jail
As we all know, the forced-birth narrative is fetuses are human beings and must not be harmed. Those who harm them must themselves be imprisoned. Lawyers for a pregnant woman in Florida are arguing the fetus cannot be imprisoned if it is not charged with breaking the law.
This is just one of many complicated legal issues that go with the absurd concept that a fertilized egg is a human being. One I've wondered about is inheritance. What if grandpa's will said, "My millions are to be distributed to those who are my decedents at the time of my death." So, the judge distributes the fortune to his decedents.
Then a woman appears with a baby. On the night Grandpa died she had a secret sexual affair with Grandpa's grandson. Her baby was born exactly nine months later. The grandson claims he does not know her but she has pictures and a motel receipt. DNA confirms the baby is his. The heirs claim the baby did not exist when Grandpa died so they are not required by the will to share the fortune. We know the forced-birth political faction will claim the baby was "a human being" at the moment Grandpa died.
More complicated is a miscarriage where the woman claims she has a right to inheritance her "baby" would have received had it lived until birth.
Endless legal scenarios can be imagined based on "a human being at conception." Even the "moment of conception" is not a "moment" but a period of time. What about the status as a human being and inheritance during that time?
The success or failure of the pregnant woman in jail will have implications that spill over into law enforcement and other area. Women get pregnant while in jail. Is getting pregnant a free pass to release?
The lack of deep thinking has been a trait of the Christian right since forever. Simple ideas work well to raise money and to gain political traction. But the implications are often more complex and don't work out well.
No one will ever accuse you of not being a deep thinker. Please make a formal appearance at a hearing for a forced death group at the state legislature. I can guarantee you the grandpa story will make national news.
ReplyDeleteMatt--So you are saying the fetus is a human being but cannot have rights of inheritance? You are a good example of the ability in the Christian to hold two exactly opposing views in your head at the same time and not see inconsistency.
ReplyDeleteI notice you did not take on the case of releasing mothers from jail because the fetus is also being incarcerated. Lies come back to haunt.
Nothing I wrote remotely resembles your conclusion. Nothing. Democrats are nothing if not habitual and compulsive liars.
ReplyDeleteWe want the Grandpa story at the Iowa Legislature!! Come on, JL!!
Anonymous (Matt)---"Nothing I wrote resembles your conclusion."
DeleteYou have not addressed the obviously unresolved issues of "life at conception." The opportunity is right here on this comment page to do so. When and how will the right to inheritance be determined? How can fetuses be incarcerated when they are not charged with any crime?
Perhaps it would be wise to recall the old adage, "Those who live in glass houses should not throw stones."
A human being is created at conception. Yes, the child can be mentioned in a Will, unnamed. If a pregnant woman is jailed, detained, going to a movie, a restaurant, shopping, etc., then the unborn child goes with her. Try using basic logic. The baby is reliant upon the mother for food and shelter, whether the mother is in a jail or on a beach in Hawaii.
ReplyDeleteI know you like to play games, thinking you are clever or cute. It isn't difficult to imagine an unborn child in a jail but not serving a criminal sentence. The baby needs its mother. Once the baby is born, it might be the time to separate the mother and child, especially if the mother is serving a long prison sentence. Her already born children might be with their father, with other relatives, etc. Perhaps the children are in foster care or are adopted out. Life is tough at times.
Perhaps a little research on the history of pregnant mothers being jailed would bring some enlightenment to the topic.
Anonymous--Matt------------------------
DeleteYou post is hilarious. You are admitting what we abortion rights advocates have been saying since day one: The fetus is part of the woman's body. If the fetus was an individual human being, it would not be legal in incarcerate it when no charges of law breaking have been filed. You can try to be cute and avoid the obvious but you've been caught red handed. You might as well fess up and accept that you are wrong.
Here is another good one, "..a little research of pregnant mothers being jailed would bring some enlightenment to the topic."
I did just that. There are over 100,000 pregnant women incarcerated. A nation-wide law prohibition abortion would free all of them. But that's not the half of it. Any woman facing incarceration would try to get pregnant to avoid jail time.
Your anti abortion bitterness has left you without the ability to think rationally about the implications of a no-abortion country.
Matt--As to the legal status of a fetus in inheritance, here is a more common kind of event. I am confident it will be in court one day:
DeleteA husband has some millions of assets in his name only. He and his wife have one child. She is pregnant and he dies. There is no will. In the states I know about, the wife gets one third, the children get 2/3rds. The second child is born. It's mother ends up flat broke and also dies. The human being at conception theory of the Catholic Church which was put into law then allows the second child to go after the millions held by the first child. The first child, of course, says no you were not a human being when father died. And off to court it goes.
You need to come to grips with the death of a fellow human being; the reality of abortion.
ReplyDeleteHeads, arms, legs, torsos, etc. Watch the Gosnell movie. He is one serial killer behind bars. He is but one of hundreds of serial killers who snip spines, put living humans on shelves to die.
This is no debate. This is whether or not you and others are ok with killing children.
Matt -- "Heads, arms, legs, toros, etc..."
ReplyDeleteThis reflects an ability you have not shared by everyone. It is the ability to transform reality into something you wish it to be. When the priest lifts the goblet, I would guess you really believe he has made wine into blood. When you hear the priest say Jesus walked on water or came back to life you are able to leave reality and go to another place not available to many like myself.
This is what you do with abortion. You are not able to defend the one cell human and the
forced-birth laws with systematic or logical arguments. What you are able to do is make a mental leap from reality, surgical abortion is removing small pieces of flesh that are part of a woman's body no different than an appendix or tumor, to a human being with mental awareness and intellectual abilities. In doing this you are able to block out the brutal consequences on others especially women.
why are you arguing about fetutes in jail? the topic is so utterly off the wall. I don't know whether to laugh at such nonsense. or to cry at such studipity. as to the appendix argument, that too is utterly stupid. appendices are not a seperate, distinct body: they are not growing rapidly, taking human shape. honestly Jon I sometimes think that you have taken leave of your senses. unfortunately you have become the poster child for those that are so blinded by some crazy ideology that they have left the world that most of the rest of it live in. impervious both to reason or empirical evidence.
Deletetsm "appendices are not a separate, distinct body."
DeleteSo, they are part of the mother. That is exactly what abortion rights people like me have said since day one. Thank you.
I'm not the only one talking about unfair incarceration--it's a court case.
Maybe I'm pushing conspiracy theories to the limit, but could this be the reason for bringing forward the argument of unfair imprisonment? In losing their case, they may get a judge who says in one way or another, "The fetus is not imprisoned unfairly because it cannon be charged with a crime. It cannot be charged because it is not a human being." This then could be used elsewhere for abortion rights.
DeleteI hope that you know that the court has thrown out this case. as it well should. the fetus is not a human being. what sort of post-modern madness is that? there is no doubt that biologically it is a human being, that is as self-evident as anything gets in this universe. but maybe you have some goofy sociological theory that you "think" proves otherwise. as to the great Catholic conspiracy (i.e. asserting that individual human life begins at conception). seems to me that the medical scientists who discovered that fact in the middle of the 19th century were, if anything, Calvinists.
ReplyDeleteIn any event, I don't think that they had any religious agenda. they were scientists looking for the facts: just the facts ma'dm. PS maybe your hangup arises from your failure to distinguish between between legal personhood and human beingness. like the slaves of old you can be human without legal personhood/citizenship. isn't what the Taney court , in effect, ruled in 1859.