What is Christian Nationalism
The practice of using the Bible to justify government powers and laws continues. Recent efforts were to outlaw same sex marriage and abortion. These efforts are based on two false claims, one is the U.S. "is a Christian nation" and the other is that these prohibitions are in the Bible and are "Christian."
While there are countless groups calling for various kinds of Christian Nationalism, a few are most well known. They are Concerned Women of America, Focus on the Family, the Family Research Council, the Alliance Defense Fund (now Alliance Defending Freedom), Faith and Freedom Coalition and the American Family Association. Other affiliated groups serve these with fund raising and political operations.
Some positions of these organizations were passed down to them from the time of slavery. Universally the claim is made their stances on issues are endorsed in the Bible. The issues include opposition to gun regulations, endorsement of home schooling (opposition to public education), private school using vouchers, same gender sex is an abomination, opposition to self identification of gender, opposition to women's rights in health care, opposition to government health care, in favor of Christian prayer in public schools, prohibiting women from the pulpit and a host of others.
There are some variations among the groups and among denominations of Christianity. But those groups who want their views put into law, Christian Nationalism, adhere many or all of the above ideas.
A common political technique has been to recruit preachers/priests into the Christian Nationalism circle. This is done by paying expenses of clergy to attend conferences and training. They learn how to use their pulpits to influence voting of their congregations. Of course large political donations are included.
Success of Christian Nationalism will mean failure of the freedom of religion in the U.S.
don't you ever tire of repeating the same old, same old. you are like an old record/CD stuck on screech. that aside why do you persist in capitalizing christian nationalism? you make it sound like a sinister organized political party (or something of that sort). seems to me that what you are referring to is, in fact, an attitude: a patriotic attitude that emphasizes the connection between Christianity and American life. in my view that's not a bad thing. BTW, you are against home schooling. that figures.
ReplyDeleteof christian nationalim
Unknown -- "seems to me what you are referring to is, in fact, an attitude: patriotic...connection between Christianity and American life."
ReplyDeleteI did not mention the inspiration for writing this blog and other comments. It is a book I'm reading, "The Power Worshippers" by Katherine Stewart. I learned about it because it was reviewed in The New Yorker. If such folks are merely a group with a "connection between Christianity and American life" you'd have to agree that is what southern white slave holders were. Just good patriotic Americans who read the Bible.
I grew up in a Protestant evangelical world and Christian nationalists (ok, I won't capitalize nationalists) were among us back then. The author spent three years attending meetings, collecting documents and talking to people in this group. If you grew up Catholic and are still a Catholic you will not see Christian nationalists in quite the same vein. That, although we see here in the comments quite a passionate desire by a Catholic to put his particulate brand of religion into the halls of power.
Jon; Can you provide a complete list of Bible verses used to justify slavery and Jim Crow, and if possible some context ?
ReplyDeleteAn area I am unfamiliar with.
Thanks
helper "Jon; Can you provide a complete list of Bible verses used to justify slavery..."
ReplyDeleteI can't be of much help. The book I'm reading carefully documents dozens of quotes from prominent people claiming the Bible justifies slavery. The source of each statement is footnoted. She seldom mentions what sources from the Bible they used. The two I happened to catch were Duet 23:15-16 and Ex 21:3-4. I looked at these and they were both "rules" pertaining to slavery. The author mentioned those using the Bible often said if there were rules about slavery that means it is approved.
I looked a "The Bible and Slavery" in Wikipedia--there is a quite long entry about those using the Bible to justify and also to condemn slavery. It points out that much of the Bible was no doubt written by the upper class who owned slaves. There is a list of books in Wikipedia, mostly written in the mid 1800's using the Bible to justify slavery.
The many quotes in the book I'm reading had a common theme paraphrased, "We must preserve a Biblical America and reject those who are trying to remove slavery." It was almost identical to the phrases we hear today, "We must preserve a Biblical American and reject those who want legalized gay marriage and abortion."
I suppose I will live long enough to see the next sentence used in religious nationalism, "We must preserve a Biblical America by...." I just know it is coming because this kind of history has repeated itself over and over.
After looking at many sources and examples, I come to the conclusion that most of this is based on having the conclusion first, then looking for the verses to validate. A practice used often with many topics, not just slavery. It's called eisegetics.
DeleteJust one or two verses does not validate. Word study in translation is necessary, Context is equally important.
DeleteCorrection: "I suppose I will [NOT] live long enough to see the next...."
ReplyDeleteIt's time to get over the slavery business. I'm sure that in OT times slavery was taken for granted, just as it was in the ante bellum south. It was also taken for granted in the ancient world generally: Aristotle, for example, was often quoted in defense of slavery. (and eugenics). That, however, is water under the bridge: get over it. Spend more effort on looking at the evils de jure. And do note that Scripture is now being used to support all sorts of things: abortion, Marxism, even violence. May I add that equating slavery with abortion, same sex marriage, etc. is an analogy that in my mind at least, limps and limps badly. As to your fears that your so-called Biblical America is coming, wake up and smell the coffee. Whatever is coming it sure as hell ain't likely to be a Christian theocracy.
ReplyDeleteUnknown--"It's time to get over the slavery business...Spend more efforts in defense of evils de jure."
ReplyDeleteThe evils de jure is exactly what I do here. Perhaps it goes right over your head.
Let's see if I can explain it slowly enough: The Bible was used to justify slavery back in history. That was an injustice. Today the Bible is being used against women and gay people. The latter is de jure. That is an injustice. Should I explain it again?
no you don't need to explain it again. you have expressed your views ad nauseum. the problem is that you and I have quite takes on the term "justice". be that as it may, I would only note that justice is a very equivocal word, often confused with mere vengeance. Or worse, as a justification for totalitarianism. As in Bolshevik justice.
Deletegot sloppy on my 0930 post. should have read "quite different takes" on the term justice.
DeleteHelper "...justice is a very equivocal word, often confused with mere vengeance."
ReplyDeleteConfused?? The Bible went from Old Testament and remarks attributed to Jesus as death was the end for sinners. But, "justice" was later introduced. "Justice" required sinners suffer, not just lay in the grave perfectly comfortable. "Hell" was introduced for one purpose only, "justice" or its more accurate terms "vengeance" or "revenge."
Try as you might to assign a more high brow angle, it's quite simple.
Error: Above was a reply to Unknown, not helper.
DeleteJONonny one note. what I wrote had nothing to do with hell. It had to do only with secular notions of "justice". Hell, of course, raises theological issues of justice but as Matt could tell you we do not go to hell because of a vengeful God, we send ourselves there. looks as if you inhaled to much OT wrath in your childhood.
DeleteJon Jul 18, 2020 at 10:56 AM. “Vengeance or revenge”
DeleteTo vengeance or revenge I would add resentment, impotent revenge, a far more pervasive and debilitating hallmark of Christianity, the “religion of resentment”. If redemption is it’s strength, resentment is its Achilles heal.
thank you Master Nietzsche.
DeleteUnknown "Hell...raises theological issue of justice...we do not go to hell because of a vengeful God. we send ourselves there."
ReplyDeleteAnd, if that is actually in the Bible, why is it there? Because it was popular. Believers wanted revenge. It goes under the nice banner of "justice." As Dr. Seuss wrote, "Oh, the games we play."
let all comers here note that I have responded to this non sequitur. Jon seems to have censored it.
DeleteI didn't think people wanted to see the same post twice. When it starts, "like I said before" it may not see the light of day.
ReplyDeletemuch in your world is hidden from the light of day. so be it.
DeleteI googled, "Christian Nationalism meetings near me" and do you know how many meetings I found? That's right - zero.
ReplyDeleteI googled, "Freethinker meetings near me" and found quite a bit.
The freethinkers much better organized and committed than this so-called "Christian Nationalism" boogey-man you created.
With dozens, if not hundreds of Christian denominations running around America, I don't think any could be convinced to work together on theology. Working together on politics? Maybe on some issues like abortion, marriage, freedom, education, etc.
I'm not sure one could get all the Catholic churches or dioceses to work together.
There is no Christian Nationalism.
Matt -- "Working together on politics? Maybe on some issue like abortion, marriage, freedom, education, etc."
DeleteThat's the point--that's Christian nationalism. The big players like the ones I mentioned are trying to create a government that puts Christian notions into law. Here is a group, I don't think it is a big player in politics, but it puts to a lie you statement there is no Christian Nationalism:
https://www.christiannationalism.com/about-christian-nationalism/
Matt 435; he sticks to his line no matter how many times he has been, if not refuted, at least made to look foolish. and, beyond all reason, he sees the threat of a Christian "takeover" behind every tree. that, while apparently ignoring the present spate of mob violence, the deterioration of political discourse, the rising tide of lies in the media, the political world and in academia. one wonders?
DeleteNo, the point is some denominations will work strictly on what is called social justice issues, e.g. oppose capital punishment, advocate for $15/hour or higher minimum wage, prison sentence normalization across races, marriage for all and between 2, 3, 4 people, socialism, etc. Others will work strictly on issues such as abortion, in vitro fertilization, contraception, traditional marriage, pro capitalism, etc.
DeleteThere is no Christian Nationalism. The closest thing to it is the Christian Coalition which is a shadow of its former self. The website you published claims to be Christian Nationalism. No people are mentioned, i.e. president, officers, staff, board members. There are some articles and some platform planks. If you click on the "join" link, it is not active.
What you define as Christian Nationalism is anyone who wants to advocate for their views becoming law. So what? Isn't that one of the things that makes America great? You can do it. I can do it. Joe and Sally down the street can do it. Your problem is you don't think Christians should have a seat at the table. You don't think our views should be tolerated so you attempt to bully and berate people for daring to advocate for pro-life, pro-marriage, etc. I would recommend "getting over it".
Again, free-thinkers are an easy group to join and find. Google search proved that. Joining a Christian Nationalism group in this area is impossible to find.
I like the idea of advocating for Christian principles. Whether you call that Christian Nationalism and then try to create a problem is up to you. I'm not falling for your thesis. Me, I'll work to undermine your free-thinker movement. It's a recipe for disaster.
Matt--"You don't think our views should be tolerated so you attempt to bully and berate people for daring to advocate for pro life, pro marriage, etc."
DeleteMaybe you would understand Christian nationalism if we returned to where it started, slavery followed by segregation. Christian nationalists of that time said the country would be a better place if they could dump on black people with impunity. The version of the same thing today is dumping on gay people with impunity--don't rent to them, don't let them have employee benefits, don't hire them. Then there is dumping with impunity on people with different views of marriage--don't rent to unmarried couples, mixed race couples etc. Ultimately its also dumping with impunity of pregnant women, anti abortion.
So go ahead and believe there are not groups out there working hard at Christian nationalism. They are there. You will only understand when you are fired by someone with another religious belief for being a Catholic or having too many children or something else from the crazy world of religion.
I understand what you call Christian Nationalism well. Let's see if there is an equivalent umbrella organization with other views advocating for their desires in the law. Free-thinkers, atheists, anarchists, anti-gun (anti-2nd Amendment), anti-White, reparationists, open borders, healthcare for all for free, etc.
DeleteWhat I do know about what you describe as Christian Nationalism has its roots 2000 years ago, not with slavery.
If you want to discuss slavery, we can discuss the roots in the Democrat party and atheism. Democrats are johnny-come-latelies to civil rights and have now proven they are incompetent in doing what's good for minority populations. This is proven in major cities across America where minority population poverty is systemic and rampant. Was it not Abraham Lincoln, America's first Republican President, that ushered in the end of slavery? Which modern day President ushered in the lowest unemployment among minority populations in US history, Clinton, Obama or Trump?
Your obsession, Jon, is on display. Your obsession has ancillary obsessions with abortion and homosexuality. Your true obsession is with opposing Jesus Christ. His way is difficult. He favors life, not death. He overcame death. He favors marriage between one man and one woman. He favors free will but He favors both corporal and spiritual consequences for what separates man from God. Slavery is a horrible sin. However, slavery from 2000 years ago meant something very different than slavery from when the Egyptian pyramids were built, different than when Blacks sold Blacks into slavery into America, before our country came into existence, before the slavery of Southern plantations, into the modern slavery of public policy which encourages and funds poverty.
Jon, I'm surprised you brought up the word "dump" as that word aptly describes what you do to Christianity and Jesus Christ.