Hanging onto One's Faith When Attacked
A peculiar column showed up on line explaining to Christians what "the enemy" does and how to combat it. The enemy, she wrote, is Satan and Satan has special techniques for separating you from God. I have reviewed some of what she wrote and added a bit of my own advice.
One thing the faithful will hear from non believers is that God did not answer their prayers. It is not healthy, the link says, to hear this. I would have to agreed hearing this over and over and seeing that it is true would cause angst. Satan must be involved somehow.
Having the enemy point out no one has ever seen God nor knows anyone who has seen him is not healthy either. Believers know God is out there someplace but they best not get into defining where he is located. Satan's minions will bug Christians about details of where heaven is located and how they know it exists. This is a circumstance best avoided.
Satan is always wanting the faithful to be questioned about who wrote the Bible and why. This is actually counter productive for Satan. Without the Bible there would be no Satan. Nevertheless, for his own entertainment Satan will have people point to inconsistencies in the Bible. When someone outside the faith wants to discuss the Bible, the mental health of believes is improved by taking a pass on doing that.
Sin is a topic best discussed among the faithful and not with outsiders. The old time religion had lots of sins that seems approved of now. To discuss them outside the faith is to allow arguments that make the faith seem arbitrary about sin. Sin has to be kept on the front burner and presented as a unified voice. When certain things are allowed by one branch of Christianity but condemned by another there is confusion as to the message of the faith.
The link author hopes all this will be helpful to believers.
Oh, I have contended for the faith with many atheists, some of them moderate, and some violently so. It's a subject many are not prepared to do. Unfortunately, the enthusiasm of a newly discovered faith, is not a solid preparation to defend the faith. I have noted seven basic techniques used by atheism to discredit the faith, and they are repeated over and over. In addition, poor scholarship, out of context, changing subject, manipulating meanings of words, attempted intimidation, are just a few of the tools used.
ReplyDeleteThe Screwtape Letters is a good outline. I suspect the author of the link is dancing around a couple points included in it.
I've jousted with Jon almost from the start, and he has not impressed. In fact many of his posts are rather quite shallow, repetitive, and funny. Especially when he goes dark or refuses to print. That should reveal much.
little helper Mar 24, 2020 at 5:35 PM
DeleteIndulge me if you will. I have one more verse from the 13th century Persian Rumi, “silence is the language of god, all else is poor translation.”. My initial thought was that it is a poor fit for Christianity given the value placed on direct revelation. Your impression please.
Ardy; Please define "direct revelation".
DeleteI assume you mean the claim of some to be able to receive revelations directly (AKA private revelation) from God? (as in God told me yada yada) and the value those place on it. If so, my impression is; it is not valid, and an opportunity for error, heresy, scam, and self agrandizement. Include in that certain dogmatic claims from the Magicsterium.
Add to that speaking in tongues. "but wait there's more" as seen on TV.
The liturgy including the lectionary and the readings for the day / Sunday, and adhering to them go a long way to prevent such practices.
The Rumi is in close alignment with "the still small voice" in the Bible. or in the case of "Two men went up to the Temple to pray". The Pharisee stood so everyone could see, saying, I'm so thankful bla bla ...not like the other guy who stood in the corner, not even lifting up his head, saying God, be merciful to me, a sinner. I tell you this man went home justified. (paraphrasing). Humility.
little helper Mar 24, 2020 at 8:48 PM
DeletePrecisely. “Direct revelation is a term used by some Christian churches to express their belief in a communication from God to a person, by words, impression, visions, dreams or actual appearance.” That you related the quote from a Muslim sage and the Biblical “still small voice" is evidence to me of the common strands in the DNA of these two Abrahamic religions. I read that Muslims, Christians, and Jews honored Rumi at his funeral. Thank you.
Ardy; Just a late after thought; Direct revelation / private revelation, and eisegesis, (reading into) to support a favorite topic. example; "you don't think Jesus would leave his mother in the ground to rot ", goes directly against Sola Scriptura.
Deletelittle helper Mar 24, 2020 at 8:48 PM
Delete“While God only loves, forgives, and accepts, Satan only judges, accuses, and condemns.” https://redeeminggod.com/christians-glorify-satan/
In the assertion above doubters judging, accusing, and condemning the faith of Christians may be considered the work of Satan. Likewise Christians judging, accusing, and condemning those in doubt may also be considered the work of Satan. Welcome to the Devil’s workshop. ;-)
re. the assertion; Moody institute, Dallas Theological says it all. More private revelation and eisegetics. The Devil's workshop indeed.
DeleteWhat's your point?
Are you trying to bait me?
DeleteArdy; Are you accusing me of " judging , accusing and condemning those in doubt"? Never ! !. In fact if I see/ observe someone in doubt, I try to help them, and explain what I believe to be true. Just as I have done for you in the past. Don't insult my best intentions.
DeleteArdy; @7;33; Islam came 600 yr after Christianity, and the "private revelations" of Mohamed contained in the Koran do have a connectiveness, as he would have had the Bible available. The largess of Islam judge the Sufi branch as somewhat heretical. Not sure on how much honor he received. Abraham Lincoln received honor at his funeral by many but not by all.
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Deletelittle helper Mar 25, 2020 at 10:28 AM
Delete“Are you trying to bait me?”
Holy S$$t! What the hell are you talking about. The reference was to the heated exchanges that sometimes occur here between believers and skeptics. This topic included references to Satan. Some including me cross the line on occasion and deride one another. Your response borders on an unfounded accusation. Good example. Take a break and have a pickle.
Ardy @ 8;14; re. "judging, accusing and condemning those in doubt"; See my 10;38. Note ; (IN DOUBT). Agnostics included.
DeleteHowever to those who are militant , confrontive and combatant atheists, that is a game changer. On the whole, I don't waste much time with them, beyond correcting and pointing out where we disagree, and why, hoping some may stick, and move from atheism to at least an agnostic. Some of it is based on mis-dis information.
Ardy; HOLY SHIT !! You are not clear as to where you are coming from ! ! !
DeleteThe last paragraph of your 8;14 "Christians accusing and judging those in doubt may also be considered the work of Satan" YOUR WORDS ! ! ! Then ; "Welcome to the Devil's workshop," Again your words. How in the world do you think I should take that?
See my 10;38 and my 12;08
Next time indicate what and to whom you are referencing. Take a break and suck on a pickerel.
Have I not been complete, fair and clear in answering your questions? That should indicate to you my good and honest intentions.
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Deletehelper "Especially when he goes dark or refuses to print. That should reveal much."
ReplyDeleteEvery time I don't answer some question demanded by a poster or do not publish something some poster enters the view of the ignored is always, I mean always, the same. It is that the poster has defeated me. I am happy posters feel that way. It's good for business (although there is no money involved here). As I have explained many times there are posts I judge not to be of interest to readers. I dump these, just as the Editorial Page Editor of a newspaper does not publish all letters to the editor.
You define an answer to prayer as God doing exactly what you wanted. I am mature enough to know that an answer to prayer is not exactly what I want. It may be far removed from what I think I want.
ReplyDeleteThe enemy can "point out" that no one has ever seen God but the enemy would be wrong. God walked on earth for 33 years. Before that, he visited many people on the earth, e.g. Moses. He is present today in the form of the Eucharist in every Catholic Church in the world.
Interesting that anyone would want the physical location of Heaven when it is a residence for spirits. If you want to know where Heaven is located, you'll have to get there. Still interested?
"Without the Bible Satan could not exist." Huh? Prior to the Bible, Satan existed. Satan's existence does not depend on the Bible's existence. I understand you are using one of his tricks to goad people but some of us are about too mature and intellectual to fall for such an easy trick.
Jon, you benefit from the problem of an ununified Christian church. Catholics believe one thing that the ELCA, Methodists and Evangelicals might all disagree on. You got us there. So what. You might as well acknowledge that all atheists don't believe (or disbelieve!) the same things. I understand you are the top of the pyramid looking down on everyone but doesn't it get a little lonely being the only one who is right all the time? Does your wife agree with you all the time?
I prefer Archbishop Fulton Sheen's worldview. He is happy when someone has even 1% of the Faith correct. The problem is when people are so evil that they actually wish and work for the separation of people from Faith. Is that where you reside in society?
I think the whole subject is moot, everyone has their own fantasies and vigorously fights to keep them. No evidence there is or isn't a god so I remain unconvinced and an agnostic.
Deletehelper 1057. as I recall Muhammed was familiar with Christian literature, Scripture included. M, as you know, thinks of Jesus as a great prophet and the references to Mary. remember that Christianity was "seeping" into the Arabian peninsula sometime before M. I also recall that Islam was often thought of as a Christian heresy of sorts.
ReplyDeleteThe Arab peninsula was a hoge poge of every ism around. Judaism, animism, Christianity, Zoroastrianism. later Islam, and the split in Islam. Sunni and Shia. Not surprising Mohammad incorporated much of the above.
Deletetrue. but as far as I know he tried to clean out the animists and the pagans. kept the black rock (I think that's what it's called) however. Jon would have fun with this comment: he thinks that much the same applied to Christianity.
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